Ep #11 – Buying Your Green Coffee, Part 2

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<Joe> Hello everybody. Thank you for tuning in to the
Mill City Roasters– Roaster School live feed.

Welcome, as you can see and as you can hear, I’m all by myself. It’s kind of a sad day today

our dear friend Dave Borton has, well hopefully, Dave is watching from his couch and hanging

out in the comfort of his home where he has been working really hard on his garden of

late and keeping up with those Twins and
Dave is no longer going to be doing the video

with me, unfortunately. He has returned to his retirement which he has very, very well deserved.

I remember quite some months ago now, something like 18 months ago, Dave called me up and said,

“Joe, we’re doing this video. We want to teach home roasters how to roast coffee better and

I’d love for you to come on, pop by, see if
you can lend some wisdom to home roasters.”

And so I thought, sure. I thought I’d, you know, maybe be on camera with him a couple times

and that’d be it and here I am today all by
myself. He has certainly been a mentor

to me and has led me in a lot of different
directions over the past 18 months and I can’t

say thank you enough, Dave. I appreciate it
and I hope the hold down the fort really well

for you and that kind of leaves it to just
you and me now. You, the roaster and me, hopefully

your mentor and rest assured that I will hopefully have some guests come in and sit next to me

and it won’t just be the Joe Morocco show.
I want this to be about you, I want this to

be about you learning how to roast coffee
better, find coffee better, and do better business.

Really over the last 18 months, we have seen a lot of you who were home roasters now decide

to jump in with both feet and become professional roasters. And we are so excited about being

on that journey with you helping you pave
the way. and so as we move forward over the

coming months, we really want to turn the corner with you and for those of you that have been

professional roasters that have started tuning in, we thank you. That was not anticipated early

on and it’s just been a joy to hear all of
the thank yous. We just got back from the SCA

Global Expo that took place in Seattle, and
my gosh, so many of you stopped us to say thank

you from all over the world. People from Saudi Arabia, from Burma, from Nepal, from all over,

said hello, thank you, we’re learning how to
roast out in our village or we’re learning

how to roast in, you know, our garage…it’s
just incredible. So thank you for tuning in

and as we move forward we hope to keep our information strong and fresh and new and that

really is going to come down to you all also
giving us feedback and sending us questions,

and being part of the program this is for
you. So moving forward, last week we talked

a lot about buying green coffee and I wanted to get into that a bit more today from a foundational

level and go through some pros and cons. Many of you who have started out as home buyers,

of course, are probably just buying small packages of coffee: either from Mill City or from one

of my other favorite resources, Sweet Maria’s, probably buying small packages. And I wanted

to talk about pros and cons of buying those
small packages, pros and cons of full size

bags, of buying forward with full size bags,
and even a little bit into buying futures

because I’m learning more more that some professional roasters that are probably over a hundred

thousand pounds a year are watching and tuning in so I want to make sure that we keep this

information vibrant and relevant to you. So, some pros and cons to buying the small

bag. The small bag is a fantastic place to
start. One, it doesn’t take up much shelf space.

You can fit it on your shelf, you can stack
it up, you can have a bunch of different offerings

and they’re all in a relatively small space. Two, as your rotating through those small bags

you don’t have to worry about the coffee getting stale. If you’re buying the size that you need

for the roaster that you need and you’re using that coffee over a month to a few months you

know that that coffee is going to be fresh,
it’s going to roast better, it’s going to taste

better and you’re going to be able to sell
it for full value. Okay. Also, another good point or a pro

is that that coffee is less money on your
shelf and more money in your bank. If you have

to buy a full bag of coffee, any inventory
that you store in your warehouse or garage

or wherever it is is going to essentially
be money that you’re not storing in your bank

that product is in need of converting into
cash. Of course, if you have it in coffee then you

know that at least you know whatever coffee you own is not going to change in its value

until you increase its value so that would
be a con. If you are buying small bags, it

may be the case that between the time that
you bought a bag last month and the time that

you need to buy a bag next month it could
increase in costs, it might even decrease in

cost according to market dynamics. Another con, however, is that if you run out of that

coffee that you have stored on your shelf
and you go to get more, it could be gone because

you don’t have the control over what the company that you are are buying from is going to have

in stock, so you are at the mercy of the company
that you’re buying from. Another con to buying

those small bags is it is a bit wasteful on the packaging front. A lot of the packaging

that exist for small bag is going to be a
little bit less environmentally friendly, especially

less environmentally friendly than burlap
will be. So there is the potential for quite

a bit of waste and if you are starting a business that is looking to be a really green company

that could be something to consider. Moving up to the larger bags, when you are buying

a larger bag from an importer and what I mean by larger is the full size back from an origin

that was packaged into that bag at origin
and then just moved around the world until

it ends up with you. If you’re buying that
full size bag then you are buying that bag

in a system we call spot purchasing. Spot
purchasing means you’re kind of buying it on

the spot, which I know that I’ve mentioned
in the past. But, the pros of buying a bag of

coffee on spot is that you have that coffee
when you need the coffee. You may, on the other

hand, be at the mercy of an inventory list
that an importer might have, but that inventory

list for full bags is going to be quite substantial compared to an inventory list for smaller

bags or partial bags, as we sometimes call
them. Buying spot also actually keeps you market-neutral.

So, over time the C Market will fluctuate
up and down. Sometimes, the C Market is high,

sometimes the C Market is low. When the C Market is high, your spot coffee will cost

more. When your C Market is low, your spot
coffee will cost less. At first, this may look

like a bad thing because it’s kind of tough
for your pricing to go up and down but if

you look out over your past, over your history, you’ll notice that if you’ve been a spot buyer

for a long amount of time the market has
been neutral over that time because you have basically averaged out

your costs. So you’re actually at a little bit
of an advantage because you are market-neutral

over a longer amount of time. However, that’s also a con because you’re not market

neutral in the short-term, so if you buy coffee when the market is low and you need the same

coffee when the markets high, you’re probably going to be paying different prices for the

same coffee and that can kind of be a struggle. Also you are, still, at the mercy of your importer

as far as what they have available, although you can generally shop around to two different

importers. I do advise working closely with
the import partners that you have, however.

Shopping around too much can really alienate you from importers and they may not know that

you are the serious buyer that you might be. So partnering with importers is always a really

good idea, especially if you’re a spot buyer. Partner then, and then as you grow your partnership

will just be enriched and I can say that from
an importer perspective that that is actually

very valid and true. Another difficulty with
spot buying is a lot of times in order to

process an order from a spot buyer, an importer has to literally write a contract for every

single individual bag that you purchase, or
every individual type of coffee that you purchase.

When writing all those contracts then
allocating coffee to those contracts, then allocating

those contract to a direct order and
then sending that direct order out to a warehouse,

and doing all the pricing structure for each
individual coffee it takes a lot of time and resources

to process those kinds of orders. So, we especially had a lot of people call and say, “hey can we

get a discount on the coffee?” And the answer is no because there is no way to discount

what is being charged because what is being charged is actually what it cost to do that

kind of business. But generally if you are
not doing spot purchasing, if you’re doing

what is called contract purchasing or forward purchasing that is a different style of buying

and that saves your importer money and and resource allocation and that can generally

save you money and resource allocation because you’re not paying them to write a hundred

different contracts for the pallet of coffee
that you’re getting. Instead, you’re asking them

to just write a few contracts and then you’re taking coffee off of those contracts. So,

buying spot can be a con from a price perspective, you might pay a little bit more per pound.

However, if you don’t know what your usage is going to be over a certain amount of time,

buying spot is really a critical thing for
you to do. If you get tied up into a contract

with coffee and you have to take that coffee over certain amount of time and you don’t

know whether or not you’ll be able to take
that coffee, you are writing a contract against

something that you don’t know yet and that’s not a very wise move, especially as you’re

establishing a relationship with an importer. So, now let’s move on to forward buying. I want

you to think about forward buying for exactly what it is, and that is putting coffee on a contract

that you don’t yet have access to generally.
Some people will call this future buying but

it’s very important that you understand that
forward is one thing and future is another

thing. When you talk about future purchasing in coffee, you’re talking about specifically

buying a future: which is 37500 pounds worth of your Commodity Market. It is a market purchase

that is to be applied to coffee later on in
the future. So if you go to your importer and

say I want to buy Coffee Futures they are
going to think you mean market value and they’re

going to think in terms of very large purchasing quantities. If you are just wanting to put

coffee on contract that is called booking
forward. Booking forward can be any quantity

of coffee. It can be one bag or it can be a million bags, but it’s specific to what coffee you’re

talking about, okay. So looking forward is a really advantage– or a really big advantage for a

lot of you that are roasting coffee because
you can look and see what coffees are coming

down the pipe in the future and you can say
I want to secure that coffee before it reaches

our shores so that nobody else can purchase
that coffee. This coffee is the coffee that I

need and so you can write a contract that
coffee will be put onto that contract. If you’re

writing a contract with me, for instance, at
Cafe Imports you– that coffee would disappear

off of our list, it’s no longer available because it’s in your possession basically. It just

happens to still be in country of origin or
on a boat or on a truck or maybe it has just

arrived at our warehouse. There are also different kinds of terms that you can use when booking

your coffee forward. The essential terms for you to know are, “subject to approval of sample–

no approval-no sale,” and that’s an acronym
and it’ll be put together in an acronym

called SASNANS. I’m sure we could write a
song about that. So that’s a SASNANS contract

simply means you are booking it, it’s allocated to your company, when it arrives to whatever

warehouse it’s going to arrive, that company is obligated to inform you that it’s there

and to send you a sample. Then you cup the sample, if the sample tastes according to what

the contract terms say then you approve the sample, that contract then fixes against the

market and your final price is set at that
point and then you can either begin taking

the coffee immediately or you can take all
of the coffee. You can– there are usually a

couple of different parts to a contract that
you are buying. There is the coffee part, which

is the physical coffee: Columbia, from a certain farm, certain elevation, all of the essential

things about that coffee, 87 points. Then there’s the price part of the coffee, so you have your

differential and you have the C Market and
those two things come together when you approve

the coffee and then there’s the terms, as far
as how long that contract is going to last

and how you be taking that coffee over time. So, when that coffee arrives if you have a

forward contract you can have a term in that contract that says we will take this over

3 months are over 4 months or however long it’s going to take for you to dwindle that

coffee contract down and then maybe you’re taking 10 bags per month out of 40 bags and

your contract term is for 4 months so then
you’re taking 10 bags, 10 bags, 10 bags, 10 bags.

All of that is put into that contract. I know
that that’s a lot of information, but it’s

essential information for you to understand
as you get into copy buying if you’re buying

full bags of coffee right now and you don’t
know about contracting and you don’t know

about different terminology that is used
on a contract and we have left anything kind

of open and in the air here please be sure
to reach out and ask us questions because

it’s important for you to have all of the
all of the tools in your tool belt as you

go out and buy coffee. Now, some of the cons of that style of purchasing are going to be

once you have fixed that coffee, it’s yours. If it’s in somebody else’s warehouse that doesn’t

mean that you can just shirk it if you find
something cheaper, or find something you like

more, you still have to take all of that coffee. If you get bored with that coffee you still

have to take all of that coffee. That coffee
is yours. And, the longer you’re importer holds

that coffee for you, it’s going to rack up more and more cost more and more cost because you’re paying

for the warehousing of that coffee until you
take it all. So it’s important that before

you contract coffee you are certain that you’ll be able to take it, you’re certain that you’ll

be able to use all that coffee in the time
frame that you state–okay, pros and cons there.

We’re not going to get too deep into Futures. But, Futures are an important thing if you

are starting to buy somewhere in the neck of the woods of about thirty thousand pounds

every quarter of a year or maybe even about a hundred thousand pounds a year, you may want

to start considering how Futures work and
whether or not buying a future is right for

you. If the market is low then you can buy
in at that market that is low and you own

that market until you run out of that 37,500
pounds and as you purchase coffees, instead

of the coffee differential just getting put
against whatever market exists that day that

differential will be put against your market
level that you secured and so it gives you

a lot of Peace of Mind as far as what your
pricing structure needs to be for that particular

given amount of time. There are some dangers to playing with the Futures Market and you

can probably see them right off the bat. It’s
very tempting to use Futures as almost like

a gambling addiction. It’s very tempting to
watch the market and try to strike when the

market is hot, try to strike when the market
is at its lowest place so that you can quote unquote

make the most money that you can. I highly
recommend against this kind of purchasing

because if you’re purchasing simply to try
to find the bottom of the market each time

the market goes down, there will come a time when that market will be high and you will

be forced to buy into that market and at that point you’re going to have a lot of soul-searching

as to how you’re going to afford to buy that
coffee. What we generally see is that when

the market is high companies that have been on low market levels instead of increasing

their prices to their customers they will
by lower quality coffee to try to keep the

same pricing structure and their quality just
degrades and degrades and degrades as the market

increases and increases and increases.
When you have your quality degrade over time the contract

of quality that you have unwrittenly the agreed to with your customer degrades, as well. Your

customer will know when your quality degrades, and they will stop by on your coffee. So,

I highly recommend that before you set out
to purchase any Futures you have a very firm

foundational understanding of what that looks like and really know what you’re getting into

because it can be a negative even if your
booking into a very low market, there a lot

of pitfalls to that. So, that is my brief synopsis of pros and cons of buying different kinds

of coffee contracts or a different styles of
green coffee purchasing. If you have more questions

about that I’m very happy to answer, and I’m happy to be kind of a neutral party. If you

want to know about Cafe Imports practices
in particular, I’m thrilled to share that with

you, but I also teach these classes for the SCA. I am one of their green buyer pathways leaders,

you know, one of our one of our instructors
in that pathway. So I know the ins and outs

from a very neutral standpoint, and I assure
you that I can be neutral. So, I would be happy

to help you and Nick do we have any questions from our audience? <Nick> The only question we seem

to have gotten so far is how long does green coffee last? <Joe> How long does green coffee last?

That is a question I get probably every day
and it’s the question that I hate giving

the answer to because I don’t have a good
answer. I have– I have tasted Ethiopian Yirgacheffe

coffee is that are 18 months landed, that means they were probably 4 months old before they

even got to our shores. So essentially almost two years old that have tasted brilliant, really just

delicious, super clean, refreshing, still taste
like Ethiopia Yirgacheffe. I have tasted some

coffees right when they land that have lost
10 points in transit and taste like 30 year

old coffee and I have tasted 30 year old coffee. So it really is a mystery and it depends on

the quality of the coffee at origin, it depends on how the coffee was dried on the patio, how

the coffee was transported. If you can imagine this coffee going into a boat and crossing an

ocean in the heat of summer and the humidity that is involved, all of those things. It’s

really tough on coffee. Transport is not something that coffee is really made for, but yet it’s

the first thing we do to it, and we do a lot
of it to coffee. So if your coffee is not really,

really stable before the leaves port, it’s
not going to be stable when it arrives. So, I would

always tend to try to get the freshest stuff
that you can. The fresher the coffee is over

all, the safer it is in the more likely it’s
going to be fresh throughout its lifetime

in your Warehouse are in your cycle. From a general consensus, I like to say try to roast coffee

within 6 months of it landing in whatever
country you’re in, and try to stay away from

coffees that are more than a year old. Coffees that are more than a year old are considered

past crop and they are generally going to
be pretty flat and dull. They’re not going to

taste horrible, but once they become past crop, they’re not really going to be good for single-origin

use or something like that . But there’s a place for all of those coffees, too. So sometimes

you can go to your importer and say hey what do you have passed crop, I’m doing flavor base

coffee or I’m doing some other project– I’m doing, you know, like a lot of times we’ll have people

use past crop coffees when they’re doing some kind of a fundraiser for people that just

want dark roasted coffee. If you’re roasting
it’s super dark, older coffees can be fine.

So it kinda depends. What’s our next question? I see you picked up the microphone. <Nick> Dave’s

wondering how the Cardinals are doing? <Joe> Oh! Dave Borton is watching. <Nick> He is watching. Hopefully from the comfort of a couch.

Ben wants to know, is the subject to approval upon arrival at the brokers warehouse

supposed to eliminate the possibility of damage in transit? <Joe> That’s right, yeah. So if you just book a

coffee site unseen, you’re kind of at the mercy of whatever happens to that coffee.

There are some ethics behind this, of course. We will have every now and then, we’ll have a company

that will book a copy subject to approval
of sample and then they’ll call up and they’ll

say I’ve got to reject that sample and I say but it came in it was 87 and we told you would

be 87 why are you rejecting it because the
quality is there? And they’ll say well, you know,

we book a similar lot with this importer and this importer and this importer. We put them

all on the table and we just like one of these other ones a little better. That’s not how that contract

works. That contract is stating we are intending to buy this coffee, this is the coffee that

will satisfy our needs. If the coffee arrives
in the situation and at the quality level

that we think it is within a realm of reasonable expectation. So like for instance, if I

say it’s an 86 and you cup it and it’s an
85.5, that’s probably reasonable expectation.

If I say it’s an 86 and you cup it and its
an 82, that’s a very different coffee. And that’s

rejectable. Okay, if I say it’s an 86 and it
arrives and it’s a 90 you can reject it if

you want, I’ll take that coffee back. <Nick> Let’s hope nobody does that. Next question would be…let me pick one out the masses here…

In forward buying, if you get an origin sample is there any way to tell how stable that coffee is going to be? Is there anything that will say this’ll hold its

value even when the rest of this arrives? <Joe> Yes, kind of. What we measure for this is water activity and moisture content.

A lot of water activity and moisture content readings have been associated
to roasting and that’s a misallocation of

that information, in my belief and opinion…
my professional belief and opinion. That information

is telling you how stable that coffee is over
a period

of time. So moisture content is telling you
the percentage of that seed that still resides

as just free water. Water activity is telling
you of that free water, how quickly is it

moving out of the seed. If you have very high water activity, not only is your coffee

unstable, but it’s also subject to mold, it subject to bacteria, and it’s subject to fungal infections.

So, lower water activity– you don’t want it too low, if it’s too low your coffee might be dead–

and about 10.5% to 11.5% moisture. The SCA guidelines are 10% to 12%.

We’re usually going to be narrower. That
guideline is a wider umbrella. So we’re

generally about 10.5% to 11.5% and we prefer 10.5%. That’s hitting

the nail on the head for us. <Nick> Now, for past crop coffees…<Joe> I thought of one other thing, sorry one

second. So another thing to think about is
at an importer we are measuring that water

activity and moisture content on the offer
sample, then before it goes in a boat we get

another sample called the pre-shipment sample, so we measure it again and then when it arrived

we get the arrival sample so we measure it
again. So not only do we have just the arrival

sample measurement, but we have all 3 so that we can triangulate and we can say this is

a consistent reading across three readings
across 3 different times at three different

places so this coffee is very likely to hold
up very well. So even though coffee may be a

little higher or a little lower in moisture
content or water activity if it’s stable across

all three readings that’s a more important
reading than just the singular reading that

you get yourself. So, this is information that
you can usually talk to you importer about. If

you are just buying spot, it’s kind of like–it’s meaningless a little bit because

you should be moving through that coffee kind of quickly. But if you’re going to have a coffee

sit around for six months, that’s probably
information that you would want to know. And

that’s information that we check on all of
our coffees because we don’t want to have

coffees fade for you or for us. Sorry, Nick, I
interrupted you. What were you asking? <Nick> Oh, I assure you, you have not. Let’s

talk about what is the “C.” We’ve mentioned
the price of C, C Market– what is C? <Joe> So the

C Market is the Commodities Exchange Market, specifically for coffee, okay. As everybody

around the world is buying coffee, they are
agreeing to a price. On any given year the

quality of coffee is going to change as an
average, so the average quality of coffee kind

of fluctuates, there for the average price
of coffee is going to fluctuate. Along with

quality, the average amount or– not the average amount– the total amount of coffee is going

to change every year and every part of the
year and every day, day-to-day, there’s only

so much coffee that exist in the world. As
coffee quantities increase, coffee prices decrease.

As coffee quantity decreases, coffee prices increase. So there’s a relatively connected relationship

here, okay. We call that supply and demand, okay. As you have a high supply, demand lowers

so people are not willing to spend as
much. As you have a decreased supply demand increases

because the same amount of people are fighting over less of that product and so those people

are willing to spend a little bit more. However, it’s more complicated than this. You also have

the dollar– and the dollar is the dictating
currency for the commodity Exchange Market.

So along with supply and demand, if the dollar is strong– so that means the last dollars buys

you more coffee then the Commodity Market will lower. So if I can buy a pound of coffee

for a dollar today, even though the value of
the coffee hasn’t changed, if the value of the

dollar increases then I can buy that same
quality from the same quantity for less dollars.

So now it may be worth $0.95. That doesn’t
necessarily correlate though to other currencies

because that $0.95 may be worth whatever a dollar had been worth in Colombian pesos. So

when we talked about buying coffee and we talked about how much the farmer is getting

it’s a very difficult thing to actually quantify
dollars and cents to exactly what’s exchanged

on any given day to a farmer. Along with that, we’ll complicate things a little bit more. Not

only is coffee bought and sold as the raw commodity, meaning not only is everybody who is buying

coffee going to use the coffee that they’re
actually purchasing. They don’t– not everybody

wants raw coffee. The majority of people that are buying and selling commodity coffee in

the form of Futures are traders, and they are only buying and selling the note or the value

of that commodity. So, the dollar might be strong, there may be a ton of coffee available,

so it may look like your market might go down low. However, if other areas in the world are

struggling they may move a bunch of their
money out of something like stock in a bank,

or stock in a business, and they might move it into the commodity of coffee so now you

have demand on the commodity of coffee even though those people are not going to actually

drink the coffee that they’re paying for. So,
they’re buying Futures, buying Futures, and

then they’re just selling those Futures and
selling those Futures and that could potentially

drive the price of coffee up because there’s
a demand on the on the Futures market for

coffee even though there’s plenty of coffee
to fulfill that demand it might still drive the

market up. So there are all these weird dynamics that are happening in the background– suffice

that to say– and that is why most of your specialty coffee is bought and sold via another mechanism

which we call the differential. So if I am
a farmer and I say it’s going to cost me $10,000

this year to produce my crop and I’m going
to produce 10,000 pounds of coffee, well I know

that I cannot sell that coffee for a $1.00
because that’s break even and I have to put

bread on my table. So I might ask for a $1.20 for my coffee, okay, but I know that the

market is doing all this stuff okay and if
the market is in a situation to where if it’s

at a dollar and I’m only asking for $0.20, I know that that market might drop and then

I might end up that $0.20 is being put on
top of $0.80, so that $0.20 would be the

differential that I would ask for but if I
ask for too little and the market drops I’m

not going to get it. On the other hand– or I’m not going to get paid enough, I’m only going

to break even– on the other hand, if I asked
for $0.50 and the market goes up now all of

a sudden the coffee that I feel was worth
a $1.20, cost the person buying it

$2.00. If the market goes up to a $1.50, and I ask for $0.50…so the farmers really in this place

where they have to kind of see into the future and figure out where the value is for their

coffee, as well as where their costs are, as
well as how much they need to make. If they

can get to wear how much they need to make is safe and they can still add a little bit

more on, that’s wise because of the market
comes off of little they still will get what

they need to make. But, it can also be unwise because if the market goes up people may not

buy their coffee and they may end up losing money. So, it’s a really difficult situation.

This is one of the things– and this is my, this is Joe talking to you, it’s me guys it’s just

me talking to you– this is one of the reasons why I love working for an importing company.

And a lot of people think that importers a kind of the bad guys that are like this middleman

but what we can do is we can help a farmer
secure a market that is high and then as the

market drops low, we can help a roaster secure the market that is low. And that is one of

the advantages of buying Futures, but the key there is if your tiny little roaster that’s

roasting 100 pounds a week you can’t really do that. If you’re a tiny little farmer that’s

growing 100 pounds a year which, most farmers are growing a lot more than that, but if you’re not

growing at container worth of coffee then
you also can’t do that. That’s why cooperatives

are so great, communities working with exporters, working with importers to where resources can

be pooled and we can help secure different
pricing structures during different times

of the year for groups of farmers. It’s a– it’s
a really cool way to ensure that market dynamics

are not destroying the coffee growing world. So it’s pretty cool. Hopefully that answered

your question, lots of information there. <Nick> That got extreme, that was good. We’re going to have to do a whole segment.

<Joe> Dave’s not here to pull me out of the weeds, sorry guys. <Nick> Yeah, Dave’s actually in the chat trying to pull you out of the weeds now.

It’s funny enough, thank you Dave. Past crop in GrainPro–quality. Can you speak to any sort of quality if were looking at past crop in and out of GrainPro?

<Joe> Sure. <Nick> Should we be only looking for past crop in Grain Pro if that is what we need? <Joe> It really, so,

if your moisture is really high and you put coffee in a GrainPro, that coffee can get locked in and

your coffee may actually fade faster if your moisture is– yes I know, I’m saying the same thing always

say, there’s no clear answer to this. If you’re moisture is stable and you put it in the GrainPro, studies

have shown that more times than not GrainPro prolong the life of coffee significantly beyond just

regular burlap. That’s why we use GrainPro. GrainPro’s main job, though, is to protect the coffee while it’s

in transport. If you have coffee that’s in
a stable warehouse, whether it’s in GrainPro or

not, it’s going to be kind of stable. But while
it’s in those situations of change, moving

across the planet, that’s what can really do
the most damage. <Nick> When’s Cafe Imports heading to Europe and New Zealand?

<Joe> We have an office in Europe, we have an offic in Berlin. We have a warehouse in Melbourne, so we are there. <Nick> You are there.

<Joe> We are there, and we have an office– we have a warehouse in Melbourne, an office in Melbourne.

So, we are in Australia, we are in– we have a warehouse in London and an office in Berlin.

So, we’re in both areas. Of course, New Zealand is not Australia– I know, I’m sorry. I don’t

know who I just offended by assuming those two things were kind of connected, but– <Nick> Geography

teachers. <Joe> That’s right, yes. But it’s a lot easier to get coffee from Australia into New Zealand,

I believe then it is from the U.S. into New
Zealand, but if you’re in New Zealand work

with our team that’s in Melbourne and they
can probably get copy directly from wherever

it is if you were buying any quantity to your
door without, like, they can circumnavigate

Australia. Actually, you can circumnavigate
Australia. <Nick> All the way around. <Joe> All the way around, it’s an island, yep.

<Nick> It’s one of the best islands.

<Joe> It’s a pretty cool island. <Nick> Might not want to get into that… <Joe> Yep, we’re going to offend our New Zealand friend again.

<Nick> That’s it! <Joe> Alright. <Nick> Those are the questions I’ve got. How can a home roaster measure moisture in a bean? That one just came in.

<Joe> I would say that a home roaster has no need to measure moisture in a bean. It’s not going to be of any use to you unless you’re

keeping your coffee around for a really long
time and in which case– believe it or not– this is going to

sound crazy, freeze that green. If you’re a home roaster and you’re going to be sitting on

green for more than 6 months, just put it in
the freezer and that will protect that moisture.

Just don’t take the same bag in and out, in and out, in and out. I recommend breaking it into

small bags for what you’re going to roast
each time so they can just reach in your freezer

and grab one bag make sure it’s watertight,
airtight, etc., maybe vacuum sealed.

But, if you are a geeky enough, as I know you are, to want to measure moisture you should

be geeky enough to buy the freshest stuff
and use only what you buy in a short amount

of time. Cool. Thank you guys so much for tuning in today. Next month, we are hoping to get deeper

into roasting some more, maybe into some production roasting a little bit more. We are going to

regroup do some planning and come up with some really fun stuff for you. If you have

questions, concerns, things of that nature, I
want to try to address those live on the show

for you. So send all of that stuff over the
Mill City dudes and we’ll try to get that

put into program mode so it may not be like me answering your question directly. Your question

may get answered in an actual presentation. So hold tight, keep those questions coming.

We’re going to build programming for you, by you, and we will keep leading the way in the

roasting industry. <Nick> Heck yeah! See you guys. <Joe> Bye.


Addicted to coffee at a young age, Nick has turned his caffeinated attention towards coffee roasting education. Behind the scenes, Nick produces, directs, and edits all video series for Mill City Roasters.